tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1436417288060370638.post4380828759499655152..comments2024-01-29T03:20:32.291-05:00Comments on ...... SHARP ELVES SOCIETY ...... Jane Austen's Shadow Stories: Jane Eyre.....Air.....Heir....Eyer....AUSTEN!Arnie Perlsteinhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/01720424361279466002noreply@blogger.comBlogger15125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1436417288060370638.post-21939971285633808322011-10-06T21:47:40.382-04:002011-10-06T21:47:40.382-04:00Hi Lit Las, I saw your response re tags, and guess...Hi Lit Las, I saw your response re tags, and guess what, I just put tags on my 10 most recent blog posts- thanks for giving me the jog to do it!<br /><br />I will gradually, over the next month, tag the rest of my blog posts (there are 619 total as of now, I am amazed to see, so it will take a while!)Arnie Perlsteinhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01720424361279466002noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1436417288060370638.post-87206141517803544032011-10-03T21:42:48.793-04:002011-10-03T21:42:48.793-04:00Those two posts both come within a week after this...Those two posts both come within a week after this one.<br /><br />I have never thought to use topic tags, any suggestions on how to do it? How does it help to navigate? I always find my old posts by searching keywords in the search box. Is there a better way? Educate me, please! ;)<br /><br />Yes, I will be publishing a book, and I will be sure to give details in this blog when that happens.<br /><br />My book will contain lots of info about the shadow stories of all of Jane Austen's novels. <br /><br />Cheers, ARNIEArnie Perlsteinhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01720424361279466002noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1436417288060370638.post-10986251893187615922011-10-03T19:29:28.287-04:002011-10-03T19:29:28.287-04:00No, I don't think I've read your other JE ...No, I don't think I've read your other JE posts yet. I'll search for them. (Personally I'd find your blog easier to navigate, and find info on, if you could possibly use topic tags.) <br />Do I understand correctly that you're going to be publishing a book? Will that have info on your original speculations on S&S (which I can't seem to find here)?Lit~Lasshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05371293247684677108noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1436417288060370638.post-74723422502615952502011-10-03T19:18:56.006-04:002011-10-03T19:18:56.006-04:00Lit-Lass, you are so right, just add that one to t...Lit-Lass, you are so right, just add that one to the long list in my post!<br /><br />Yes, it's circumstantial, but when there are 25 circumstances, all aligned like ducks in a row (I don't know if you read my two additional posts in April 2011 about Jane Eyre--check the post listings for them), then it's proof. And I have more stuff too, and some of it is better than all the stuff I have publicly posted!<br /><br />Anyway, thanks for your post, and please, feel free to point out more if you see it! ;)<br /><br />Cheers, ARNIEArnie Perlsteinhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01720424361279466002noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1436417288060370638.post-83366054175477089112011-10-03T19:08:52.827-04:002011-10-03T19:08:52.827-04:00Although I find your evidence on this subject circ...Although I find your evidence on this subject circumstantial, I'll add another similarity. Jane Fairfax and Mrs. (Alice) Fairfax are alike in their reticence to give information on a man of interest to the heroine. I believe CB writes that Mrs Fairfax seemed either unable or unwilling to give Jane much information on Mr Rochester and of course we all know Emma's frustration with Jane's answers about Frank. (It's debatable how much Mrs Fairfax was in on the secret of Bertha, so there's the possible parallel secret.)Lit~Lasshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05371293247684677108noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1436417288060370638.post-34450816183964039912011-05-01T11:32:30.833-04:002011-05-01T11:32:30.833-04:00Yes, Steve, that is precisely why I wrote the titl...Yes, Steve, that is precisely why I wrote the title of this post as I did--I think that Charlotte Bronte intended the reader to see homophones on "air", "heir" and "Eyer"! <br /><br />And I am not sure if I am the first to understand the pun. When it occurred to me after watching the latest Jane Eyre film adaptation, I Googled and saw that a few others had seen the pun-- but whether they also realized that this was intentional on Bronte's part, I cannot tell.<br /><br />Thanks for your reply!<br /><br />ARNIEArnie Perlsteinhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01720424361279466002noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1436417288060370638.post-31457425524174110222011-04-30T00:42:00.495-04:002011-04-30T00:42:00.495-04:00Arnie:
Since you like puzzles, did it ever occu...Arnie:<br /> <br />Since you like puzzles, did it ever occur to you (or anyone else) that Jane's last name is a homonym for "heir", and therefore a clue that Bronte cleverly and deliberately concocted to one of the mysteries that resolve the novel.<br /><br />Steve SkrainkaSteve Skrainkanoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1436417288060370638.post-68336062064237779452011-04-19T17:53:12.417-04:002011-04-19T17:53:12.417-04:00Jean, thank you very much for that correction, I a...Jean, thank you very much for that correction, I always welcome them when given in such a gracious way! ;)<br /><br />Cheers, ARNIEArnie Perlsteinhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01720424361279466002noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1436417288060370638.post-42984427682252731392011-04-16T16:22:07.398-04:002011-04-16T16:22:07.398-04:00Arnie, I came over to your blog from your comment ...Arnie, I came over to your blog from your comment on Vic's and my review of the new Jane Eyre at Jane Austen Today, http://janitesonthejames.blogspot.com/2011/04/jane-eyre-2011-review-by-two.html. <br /><br />I look forward to reading much more of your interesting blog. Just wanted to comment briefly today on one thing in this post, where you say "Helen Burns who is dying of typhus." While the rest of the girls who died did so of typhus, Helen Burns did not. She had consumption and was not in the typhus ward with all the other sick girls.Jean | Delightful Repasthttp://delightfulrepast.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1436417288060370638.post-74101302108739677492011-04-13T13:04:45.050-04:002011-04-13T13:04:45.050-04:00"Not quite and thanks for being patronising!&..."Not quite and thanks for being patronising!"<br /><br />I merely returned the favor you so kindly bestowed on me. ;)<br /><br />But am glad to have some more substance to respond to now.<br /><br />"but if it was a court case, it would be dismissed because all the evidence is circumstantial, at best."<br /><br />As my summary shows, I am not the first to see all the allusions to Austen in Jane Eyre, I am merely the one who has collected past discoveries, added my own, and put it all in a larger context. It is a circumstantial case where the circumstances strongly point to my conclusion, I claim. <br /><br />"it sounds really far-fetched to say she got the inspiration from a woman who died 20 years prior to JE's publication rather than from her own life."<br /><br />You misread what i wrote--of course Bronte would have been interested in Austen's novels and life precisely because they resonated so strongly to her own life experiences, but I never said that Bronte was looking ONLY at Austen's novels and life!<br /><br /><br />"I personally can't see any particular similarities between JA's novels and JE...I sadly haven't read a JA novel for about ten years, so am more brushed up on filmed adaptations."<br /><br />There's your problem, Traxy. If you do read all of Austen's novels carefully, and I urge you to do so, and then go back to my post and read the extreme specificity of the allusions which I carefully detailed (for example, I did not say that the name "Edward" was a clear allusion by itself, it was all the specific detail surrounding names that marks the allusion as intentional- the devil is in the little details), then perhaps you will realize that these are not just "memes" floating down through the literary ages, and that you CAN'T just do the same sort of mixing and matching of Jane Eyre with any other novel you choose.<br /><br />And by the way, Bronte mentions Pamela early in Jane Eyre precisely in order to flag that as ANOTHER allusion she is covertly making! I have not sussed it out, but it looked very promising to me, as Bronte knew Richardson's writing too. <br /><br />"being more than a little obsessed with JE, I have found similarities with it in some really surprising places, some more far-fetched than others."<br /><br />And I'd love to hear them (I really mean that), I am sure they are interesting, and perhaps they will connect in strange ways to Austen as well! <br /><br /><br />"Whether or not CB had read JA when she claimed not to ... well ... so what? Can't really see why she would've had a reason to lie about it, does it change anything?"<br /><br />It opens up a world of shared meanings that have been declared off limits for 150 years because of Bronte's letters to Lewes. There are a lot of us in the world who love both Jane Eyre and Jane Austen's novels!<br /><br />Thanks for continuing to talk!<br /><br />Cheers, ARNIEArnie Perlsteinhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01720424361279466002noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1436417288060370638.post-64202654647211602322011-04-13T11:59:15.207-04:002011-04-13T11:59:15.207-04:00Not quite and thanks for being patronising! I summ...Not quite and thanks for being patronising! I summarised the <i>overall theme</i> of your admittedly long post and gave a couple of examples as to not make my comment too long.<br /><br />Let me re-phrase: Your post is interesting (and well-researched, yes, well done - and no, I'm not being sarcastic now) but if it was a court case, it would be dismissed because all the evidence is circumstantial, at best. I brought up governessing, Lowood and typhus because those particular points relate to <i>CB's own life</i> and it sounds really far-fetched to say she got the inspiration from a woman who died 20 years prior to JE's publication rather than from her own life. To say she put in the typhus epidemic and made Jane a governess as an hommage to JA rather than to <i>her own family</i> is insulting, frankly. <br /><br />I personally can't see any particular similarities between JA's novels and JE, aside from perhaps themes that could just as easily be traced back to the pages of <i>Clarissa</i>, <i>Pamela</i>, <i>The Castle of Otranto</i> or any other popular novels that would have been around at the time.<br /><br />I sadly haven't read a JA novel for about ten years, so am more brushed up on filmed adaptations. Plan on reading all of them in the near future, though, <i>just because</i> it's been far too long. :) On the other hand, being more than a little obsessed with JE, I have found similarities with it in some really surprising places, some more far-fetched than others. For you as an Austen fan doing a similar thing with JE really comes as no surprise.<br /><br />Whether or not CB had read JA when she claimed not to ... well ... so what? Can't really see why she would've had a reason to lie about it, does it change anything? They're both great novelists, and hey, we're still talking about them nearly two centuries later. That ought to count for something! :)Traxyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13249884092846934427noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1436417288060370638.post-30625841196119834552011-04-13T07:55:25.297-04:002011-04-13T07:55:25.297-04:00Tracy, you dismiss, with one breezy sentence, a lo...Tracy, you dismiss, with one breezy sentence, a long post filled with specific textual references, and seize upon the least significant point I made, a sure sign that you had no substantive rebuttal to make on all my other points.<br /><br />And if you read my latest post, you will see an additional allusion to Mansfield Park which i found in Jane Eyre. <br /><br />n But I thank you all the same for taking the time to respond.<br /><br />Cheers, Arnie<br /><br />Cheers,<br />ArnieArnie Perlsteinhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01720424361279466002noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1436417288060370638.post-15564046008686722652011-04-13T07:30:21.581-04:002011-04-13T07:30:21.581-04:00Sounds like you're clutching at straws for the...Sounds like you're clutching at straws for the most part, seeing connections where there are none. For instance, with the typhus - it might have nearly killed JA, but it <i>definitely</i> killed a few of CB's sisters, and Lowood is based on a school they were all sent to, and where typhus broke out. Edward is a common name, age and status gap romances aren't exactly unique, and how Jane became a governess? How about because CB was one herself? ;)Traxyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13249884092846934427noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1436417288060370638.post-87535315404819699612011-04-11T14:58:31.225-04:002011-04-11T14:58:31.225-04:00Absolutely, and add to the absurdity that Bronte w...Absolutely, and add to the absurdity that Bronte was obviously extremely well read, there are a number of overt literary allusions in Jane Eyre, and an even greater number of thinly veiled ones, including Shakespeare, Milton, etc.<br /><br />Lewes was earnest lover of literature, but he lacked that wicked sense of irony that both Austen and Bronte had.Arnie Perlsteinhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01720424361279466002noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1436417288060370638.post-82598858718668647772011-04-11T14:55:47.226-04:002011-04-11T14:55:47.226-04:00Arnie-
Quite interesting and when you think about ...Arnie-<br />Quite interesting and when you think about it absurb that Bronte had not read any Austen since her works were maybe out of print for only a year of two after her death.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.com